FSS-Reset Proposal

Tue Apr 5 16:53:32 UTC 2011

Hi Justin,

Yes, I think you're right. Having fss-reset.css @import the new files will just be for backwards compatibility. We can deprecate it and encourage users to choose amongst the finer-grained files based on the needs of their application.

We still need CSS concatenation support in the Builder, one of these days.

+1 for 2b.

Colin

On 2011-04-04, at 11:30 AM, Justin Obara wrote:

> To add my personal opinions. I'm currently leaning towards Proposal #2b. It keeps things relatively the same, but provides our users with more flexibility. The performance hit is something that we should make note of though. Here's a page that explains some of the performance issues around loading css.
> 
> http://www.stevesouders.com/blog/2009/04/09/dont-use-import/
> 
> I wonder if we should still depricate the fss-reset.css file and encourage the use of linking the two separate files directly instead?
> 
> Thanks
> Justin
> 
> On 2011-03-31, at 4:18 PM, Justin Obara wrote:
> 
>> At the FSS meeting today, we talked about a couple of proposals for addressing fss-reset, see below. Please let us know which solution you prefer and why. I'm hoping that we'll be able to come to a consensus on what is the best approach to take.
>> 
>> Thanks
>> Justin
>> 
>> Proposal #1
>> -----------------
>> 
>> Depricate the current fss-reset.css file and switch to using the reset, base, and font files from YUI3, including both the global and in-context versions of the files. These files would all be provided individually (not concatenated).
>> 
>> Rationale #1
>> ----------------
>> 
>> 	• rely on YUI's expertise and resources
>> 	• it's more widely used and familiar CSS
>> 	• basically our current fss-reset is a componsition of YUI2's reset, base, and font files. Including YUI directly is more explicit about this
>> 	• fss-reset.css mixes together reset, base, and font and might be too much for some users.
>> 		• it both clears all styles and sets default styling
>> 
>> Cons #1
>> ------------
>> 
>> 	• confusing to be carrying around 2 reset files
>> 	• themes are likely built with the assumption that one of the resets has been applied
>> 	• YUI3 namespaces their in-context version, but includes the version number in the namespace. This will make upgrading difficult for our users.
>> 
>> Proposal #2
>> -----------------
>> 
>> Keep fss-reset.css as is, and add a contextual/scoped version. This would be similar to how YUI3 has an in-context version. In this case the user would be able to only reset portions of the document, rather than having it affect the entire page when included.
>> 
>> Rationale #2
>> ------------------
>> 
>> 	• By keeping fss-reset, it keeps things stable. There will be no need to worry about backwards compatibility. 
>> 	• The additional contextual/scoped version allows for more flexibility in the use of the fss-reset on a page.
>> 
>> Cons #2
>> ------------
>> 
>> 	• This doesn't include an update to the latest YUI 3 files. 
>> 	• Users who have found the FSS too heavy handed will continue to
>> 
>> Proposal #2b
>> ------------------
>> 
>> Same as proposal 2, with the exception of breaking up the fss-reset into multiple files. For example fss-reset-clear.css and fss-reset-base.css (names are just examples, not necessarily what we will use). The fss-reset file would remain, but would only include information to link in the other two files. 
>> 
>> Rationale #2b
>> --------------------
>> 
>> 	• This adds even more flexibility on top of Proposal #2, by allowing users to pick and choose what they like. 
>> 		• For example, if you want the reset, but not the default base styles. 
>> 	• Backwards compatibility is preserved by maintaining the single fss-reset.css file which fetches the two parts.
>> 
>> Cons #2b
>> -------------
>> 
>> 	• Lots of extra files. reset will grow from 1 file to 6, after including the contextual/scoped versions. 
>> 	• Importing CSS from another CSS file will slightly increase the overhead of fetching the resources for a page. 
>> 
>> On 2011-03-17, at 9:33 AM, Justin Obara wrote:
>> 
>>> At the dev meeting yesterday we talked a bit about updating the fss-reset file. One of the things that we discussed was "At what point does updating fss-reset become a backwards compatibility breaking api change?".
>>> 
>>> Another option would be to provide the YUI css files (base, reset, and font) individually rather than concatenating them together. We could then update or deprecate the fss-reset file. This would provide backwards compatibility but allow for more flexibility for our users.
>>> 
>>> I'm wondering what the communities thoughts are on this issue.
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> Justin
>>> 
>>> On 2011-03-15, at 12:59 PM, Justin Obara wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I've attached a pdf with the summary of the changes between the current fss-reset and the fss-reset-new file that concats the YUI 3.3 css files.
>>>> 
>>>> Not that we'll probably want to maintain the custom changes.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks
>>>> Justin
>>>> 
>>>> <reset_changes.pdf>
>>>> On 2011-03-14, at 3:34 PM, Justin Obara wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> During our FSS chat there was some talk about the fss-reset file. Some felt that it was too heavy handed at times, others didn't mind. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Here's a site that has info about several of the popular reset files, http://www.cssreset.com/ . 
>>>>> 
>>>>> The FSS-reset is based on the YUI v2.5.2 reset, base, and font files. YUI has since release YUI v3.3. In addition to the few changes they have made to these files, they have also provided contextual versions. What this means is that rather than having the styles apply globally, you can chose a version of the file that scopes changes to a class name. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/3/cssreset/
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think we should consider upgrading to the latests version of the YUI reset, base, and font files, as well as providing an fss-reset-context file that is based on the respective contextual versions.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I've created a branch in my infusion fork on github which includes the updated reset file (fss-reset-new.css), the contextual reset file (fss-reset-context.css), and a test page (withNewReset.html).
>>>>> 
>>>>> https://github.com/jobara/infusion/tree/fss-reset-upgrade
>>>>> 
>>>>> Please let me know what you think.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> Justin
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> 
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---
Colin Clark
Technical Lead, Fluid Project
http://fluidproject.org